Introduction
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today on the servant leadership podcast we are joined by John Ferguson as founding pastor of Community Christian
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Church in Chicago and the driving force behind the new thing Network John is a humble servant leader in the world of
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faith and Community Building under John's guidance Community Christian Church became one of America's largest
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churches John has become a leader in the Christian church globally with thousands of pastors joining the new thing
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movement and looking to him for leadership and guidance JN is passionate about empowering others fostering
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collaboration and helping people find their way back to God today John will share his invaluable insights on servant
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leadership and how it can help you start build and grow a team that can have a lasting
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impact you have such a crazy Journey tell us tell us what happened and how you got here yeah well you know I was
Jons Journey
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fortunate I grew up in a great Christ following home and I had parents who uh not only profess to believe in Jesus but
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just lived it out I mean their life match their words I so the upside of that is it was an incredible childhood
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the down side of that is I have no excuse like there's no reason for me to not like have it good right now and so
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it really set me on a trajectory where you know I knew I wanted to follow Jesus at an early age uh I was probably about
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third no 10 10 when I made it public and in our church it was old school man you had to walk down the aisle and in front
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of everybody profess your faith in Christ at the end of that aisle at the front of the church Church Gathering there was my dad so that was kind of
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cool and then I mean was your dad a pastor yes my dad was a pastor yeah right and so we were I was baptized right then and there they didn't waste
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any time they took you around back they put a robe on you and you're dunked in that moment right then and there and so
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yeah it set me on a great trajectory and you know later in high school uh continue to follow Jesus there were ups and downs doubts you know some
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rebellions here and there but overall uh St a pretty good path uh had some great friends in my youth group and then
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eventually decided I wanted to go into Ministry and that's what I did and uh started a church with my brother and a
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handful of friends when I was 23 wow yeah we had one of my friends was
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21 my brother was the Elder Statesman on the team at 25 it's incredible I mean I I I often
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say I can believe people showed up for the first time I can't believe they came back right I mean like didn't they look
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around and go okay I've seen children's church now we're the adults you know what I mean how many people showed up that first week well we did okay this
The First Week
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was in the era of um Direct Mail marketing and actually we did phone marketing too t telemarketing yeah
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haven't said that in probably 15 years but so we called literally uh 50,000
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people holy moly yeah we made 50,000 calls over a period of about five or six weeks and then we followed that up with
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five pieces of direct mail all intended to invite people to come to the first Sunday and then on that first Sunday
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there was 465 people that showed up for sure no way no lie yeah 465 people
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showed up so I don't know if that would be Ive now I don't know what telemarketing would look like is that what you were expecting that many people
The Numbers
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I I hate to say it because I mean the data at that time would have said if you send five pieces of mail to 50,000
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people then you should get 1% return okay and so 465 is not far from 1% if
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we' had 500 been right on it so in some ways I think we probably did and and
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again you know we were doing small groups and some uh community outreach activities that sort of thing as well but but part of that too is like I mean
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I was 23 I thought you know we could do anything and everything right and so you
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know if a thousand people would have shown up I would have been like oh this is the way it works wow that's amazing well don't ask me
The Aftermath
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what happened after that what what how many people week two yeah right that's the question it was probably about half
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of that week two and then uh funny story is uh you know July 4th weekend of that
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year which was 1989 church is 33 years old 3 be 34 years old actually in about two weeks
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wow uh July 4th weekend you know one of the past one of the pastors you know most nightmarish weekends right
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everybody's out of town everybody's on vacation it's slightly better maybe than the Sunday between Christmas and New Year's and so we're like going okay I
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wonder if anybody's going to be there and hardly anybody was there like you know we're in this room that seats like 400 there's about 65 adults in the room
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and afterwards I'm like huddled up in the corner like rewriting my resume thinking okay this is over we're done oh
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my gosh yeah but we survived and you know God was God was good uh definitely
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uh you know got us through some some crazy mistakes we made along the way um but he was faithful and and here we are
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30 crazy three years later so what was it like doing it with your brother and
Doing it with your brother
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being involved and he's still involved today right yeah yeah great question uh
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you know part of it is okay we grew up together and he was two and a half years older than me and so it was kind of like
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the perfect age spread I think where yeah admittedly I'm very competitive I hate to say this he could beat me in
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almost any sport if I was ever to defeat him in something like in one-on-one basketball or something else it was almost like the world shifted on its
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axis slightly like it just f it felt wrong to me even when I would win but it was so seldom but we were just great
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friends good friends did things together growing up uh we had our D&J Lawn Service when we were the kids Dave and
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John and you know went to college together we were roommates for a while so we always got along and it just made
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sense when we started dreaming of what we might want to do with our lives and the idea of starting a church it was
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like let's just do this together I mean why not that'll be fun that's amazing so
The vision
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as it as it went through the years what was the vision back then for where it would be I mean did you even have a
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vision for 10 years later where it would be or what was that Vision this is the upside and downside of starting when
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you're 23 because you know we have had we've had steady growth that wasn't like explosive growth you know from the
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beginning but always like that probably 10 to 15 I think maybe maybe a couple years is was like 15 to 18 perc growth
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but usually in that like 10% year after year kind of growth and so you know five years into it you know we were probably
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like you know four or 500 consistently on a weekend uh a lot of people engage in small groups doing some pretty cool
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things in the community but people would say did you ever think that it would be like this and of course I was 28 at the
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time I'd be like well honestly I I thought it would be a lot more than this but I had no idea how hard it would be
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right so uh yeah so it it was it was it was just slow but steady kind of growth
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over the years I forgot the question you asked me actually it was it it was just around what the vision was for 10 years
The threephase vision
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well the thing is Yeah we actually did we had like a written out Vision uh there was four of us sitting in a Hen
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House restaurant in Central Illinois College just out of college and we sat down and crafted this three-phase
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Vision that honestly like to this day we still see that as our old kind our
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vision for a Community Christian Church and phase one was we wanted to be an impact church and that meant we wanted
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to reach people who were far from God people that were facing a christless eternity we just that compelled us
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second phase of that Vision was we wanted to be a reproducing church so we didn't want to just start one church we felt like you know we could reach more
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people and have a greater impact if we multiplied over and over again and had to impact churches and communities all
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over the all over the country and maybe even Beyond and our idea of an impact church is not only one that's reaching
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people who are far from God but it's one that like if it suddenly disappeared like the community would notice and go
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wow we were a better Community with that church here what happened so we wanted to have that kind of an impact so phase
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two was to be a reproducing church and then phase three would be uh if God was so blessed that we could be a catalyst
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for a movement and that was the idea that you know maybe we could have churches both domestically globally and
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that you know this thing could just take off and we'd see a move of God like we've not seen in our lifetimes so that was our three phase vision that we wrote
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up months before we ever even had a small group or services or anything and
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you basically stayed true to that the whole time honestly yeah I mean by God's grace we have and it's the kind of
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vision that you you know you never complete of course but it's kind of like a Great Commission you never complete that either at least doesn't look like
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in our lifetimes it'll happen but uh yeah we continue to pursue that so you're in your 20s you're starting out
Mentorship
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study growth along the way was there anyone that came alongside you from like a mentorship or like influence
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standpoint that you look to from afar that was like oh man hey we I'm just learning along the way from these people
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oh yeah absolutely couple people come to mind immediately like I'd say three people one uh Lyall Sher ly Sher lived
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in naville he's he wrote probably 60 or more books on Church life he was the United Methodist uh but just a brilliant
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guy and uh ly was just kind of an older guy even when we first got to know him and he'd always were white v-neck
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t-shirt usually with like some food stains on it somewhere but he lived in aille and his wife Agnes uh sometimes they would have
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us over for brownies and she could make some meme brownies uh but but ly actually was at one point I think it was
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a Los Angeles Times named him one of the most influential church leaders in America uh he wasn't
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super well known but he was absolutely brilliant and influenced so many people and uh one of the things ay would say to
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us from time to time he'd say you know what your guys's problem is and he didn't go to our church but he would show up on occasion he'd say my vision
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is for your church is bigger than your vision is for your church wow which was a little like you know we were
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competitive enough it's like oh yeah well but there were other uh you know bits of wisdom he dropped on us from
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time to time that were just super helpful really brilliant guy um the other person I would say Carl George
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another guy out of the Fuller Institute u in Pasadena wrote a number of books on Church growth and just strategies for
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for church development at that time that super helpful uh one other guy would be uh Lyman Coleman uh his brother was
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um Robert Coleman who wrote a master plan of evangelism oh yeah yeah yeah and
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a lot of people know about Robert but not many people know about Lyman but Lyman in gave his life to helping
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pastors um start and lead and equip people to to hold and facilitate small
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groups that would include Believers and non-believers he believed from the beginning that if you set a context like
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that that's safe for people who are far from God that they'll actually interact on scripture and the story see themselves in the stories of scripture
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and eventually find their way back to God as a matter of fact real quick our mission statement is helping people find their way back to god wow and Lyman
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Coleman is the one that gave us that because we were at one of his conferences and he he' get super passionate tears would well up in his
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eyes and he would retell the story of the prodigal son and then he would say you know there are prodigals in every
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one of our communities who desperately need to find their way back to God and as soon as we heard that we're like okay
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that's it find your way back to God that's gonna be our mission stud that's amazing that was about 18 months into the life of the church yeah so I think
Speed bumps
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one of one of the things that people see probably when they look at you at first is there's this mega church pastor and
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life has been easy you know you started this when you're in your 20s and now look at you 30 years later and
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everything is perfect thousands of people attending you've written a bunch of books all this kind of stuff there had to have been speed bumps like it it
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can't have been this easy right no give us an example of some of those speed bumps right great question um I mean
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some of the most obvious ones come along as the you know Financial speed bumps uh you know probably one of the first times
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we really hit one of those uh would be like 2007 2008 which was you that's a
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pretty good run from ' 89 like we literally had probably 15 to 18 years where I mean things were fairly smooth
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it wasn't easy we were young and we made mistakes uh but overall it it was a pretty smooth run and so when the
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financial crisis hit then and we had to go through some really tough tough decision-making processes and had to you
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know let go of some some staff we had uh cut back on some of our plans and I
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think part of what made that so hard we hadn't gone through hardly anything like that before so that and we've had you
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know since then there's been a couple of times like that I think personally uh in some way just
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like always being in in sort of a leadership and responsibility role from
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the age of 23 that is something that I don't think I've always even gauged or understood
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the full impact of that I think I'm still figuring that out right I don't know if that makes sense or not yeah so
Leadership lessons
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on that what are what are some of the leadership lessons that you think they you've learned along the way that you think people should be thinking through
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in their own life well on a personal level uh boy I I mean just to be honest
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with you TW you know the co was tough for so many people and uh so I hit you
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know again fairly smooth ride you know challenging Seasons I you know I have two kids they're they're young adults you know the teen years with them
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raising children you know my wife uh has you know just been incredibly supportive throughout all of this and she's an
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amazing person too so you know it's hard to think about okay what were the challenges over the course of like 33
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years but um one of the biggest ones probably was uh in Co and I think part
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of that is this idea of being in a role of responsibility for so long I don't know that I realized that my I was
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already running and un empty and my tank was fairly depleted I wasn't doing some of the things that I know I needed to do
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to replenish myself and take care of myself and in the spring going into the summer of
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2020 I just I hit a wall never never experienced anything like that before uh
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I always was able I'm again I'm super competitive love leadership you know Love Leading meetings love communicating
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love talking and for the first time so many of those things that I always loved to do just felt like
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brutally hard work I wasn't looking forward to any of it and I I just like what is wrong with me I've never
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experienced that before I've told people I've always been able to kick it into fifth gear and it was almost like if
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you're you know driving a a stick shift it's like you're grinding I could not find Fifth Gear well here you like
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basketball yeah uh it it's it's almost like you know when you're on the basketball team if you're like a a Hooper if you love to play play ball you
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want to be the guy that gets the ball right and take that last shot the winning shot it was almost like I didn't want the ball anymore does that help you
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and and I like felt that way before and so uh it was tough I just remember um
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being on the phone call my brother early one morning I'm like dude I don't know what's going on but I just I think I just got to stop I just can't I can't do
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this right now and he's like well just stop I'm like okay yeah right is that a
Just stop
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good or bad thing that he said just stop well it's it's very typical of my brother which it's great but it's very
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task focused too he's not thinking about NE necessarily the implications of just stopping but it was it was what I needed
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to hear though too because I think he he knew I mean we know each other so well he's like oh if he's saying this like this is like real we got to like do
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something and so I did I stopped for about five or six weeks just pretty much stopped everything um started reading
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anything and everything I'd burn out uh Pete skazo was super helpful to me emotionally healthy spirituality Wayne
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Cordo wrote a book uh years ago leading on empty I felt like it was like reading me uh went uh uh sought some some uh
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therapy you know for probably the better part of the year started putting in some practices that should have been in place
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a long time ago paying more attention to Sabbath just like rule of Life stuff about like oh no this hour in the
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morning of quiet and reflection isn't just like optional that I do like fairly
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often it needs to be like a daily deal um and so I would you know I feel great
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now but it was that was a tough season man wow it was weird so when you think through all of
How did it affect others
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that season and things the things that you're dealing with do you think people around you were feeling the effect of
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that or were you able to hide it how did how did it affect other people that's a great question so I don't know if you
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know anything about any G on in gram three and so me too are you really okay
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with a wing of two me too oh boy we're really similar well okay so you know like all right I probably and this is
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this just full disclosure I care more about people thinking I'm successful than even being successful yeah I mean
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in my heart of hearts there's a part of me that that's the dark side right right and so the last thing I wanted to do was
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let anybody know that there's anything wrong I'm great I'm fine are you kidding me we'll get through this and so that
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was one of the first times I think in my life where it was like no I just had to be like brutally honest say no I'm not
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okay no I can't do this and I need help wow so yeah it was it was it was
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different when when you're going through all of this obious viously starting in church um was a life-changing moment
Lifechanging moments
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dealing with that crisis is a life-changing moment throughout Co were there any other times throughout that
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30-year period of just life-changing moments or even before that well I mean you know I I always say
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one of the most life-changing moments for me was being born in the family I was born in because that you know immediately gave me parents that just
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love Jesus authentically and you can't really replace that and then it also meant that I was the younger brother to
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the individual I end up doing all this with for the rest of my life so those had massive implications as soon as I
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arrived on this scene right uh in in addition to that though you know I think there's just been Seasons throughout the
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church where you know we had to make decisions you know we um went from one location to two locations we had uh one
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of our uh youth pastors approach us and say Hey you know I think I'd like to to start a church and we were like no I
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don't think we want you to do that we like you as our youth pastor turns out though you know God had something
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something else in mind and uh uh that was the first church plant you know now new thing the church planning mission
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that we have there's over 6,000 churches globally that are connected to it one way or another we didn't start all of
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them but they all kind of have the same values of of multiplication and helping people find their way back to God um so
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those are you know pivotal moments at the moment you don't necessarily know it but looking back yeah absolutely for
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sure wow so throughout all of this one of the one of the main themes of this podcast is servant leadership right and
Servant leadership
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you've been you've been in a position where you've been LED really well um by
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or you've LED really well a lot of people uh on the flip side when you think of servant leadership what do you think of yeah great question uh first
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image comes to mind of Jesus washing the feet of the disciples and just the humility that took in that moment when
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you can only imagine all that was in his mind and all the pressure he was feeling
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and yet he still had the presence of mind to serve in that moment I just hop that I would even like maybe be a shadow
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of that in a similar situation or in any situation so I always think of of of of
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Jesus watching the feet of the disciples I I also think of uh something that um
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Andy Stanley uh in one of his books I can't remember which one it is uh he said you know you need to look for look
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to people's potential not their performance and that's always kind of stuck with me uh we talk about having uh
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what we call I see in you conversations we say the four most important letters in the alphabet or I see in you and so I
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think a servant leader is someone who doesn't gauge somebody just on their performance but on the potential that
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they see in them I mean um Joseph uh what's his last name H it Escapes Me
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Right Now wrote a book organic Community Joseph Myers and he said the number one question a potential leader has is not
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what's in it for me but it's why me think about that it's not what's in it for me it's why because we kind of think
Seeing potential in others
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oh I got to convince this person to lead and I got to tell them all the great things that they're going get out of leading He suggests what they really
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want to know is well why why do you think I can do this why are you picking me it goes back to that I see in you look to the potential not just their
20:09
performance and so I think if we look at people in that way that may be one of the best ways we could truly serve I
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mean Jesus did that all the time right looked at Peter and you know saw this crazy fisherman that talked too much and
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always put his foot in his mouth and said now I see in you someone who could lead my church wow that's incredible I
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mean act1 18 uh you will receive power right when the Holy Spirit comes on you
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and you will be my Witnesses that's like one big I andu statement to all of his followers before he left to go to the
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father and you know you're going to take this message to the ends of the Earth it's pretty profound stuff so yeah I
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mean there's lots of images of Serv leadership but I think being that kind of person that sees potential in others I think is one of the best ways we can
20:50
serve people as as you're thinking of servant leadership and just leading an organization sometimes leading an
Leading an organization
20:58
organization and leading individuals on that team if you will
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don't always align with the same direction how do you deal with something like that how much time do we have going
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into some deep dark Waters now well and I assume you mean what happens when someone just doesn't seem to be in
21:17
alignment with the organization yeah like the icnu how do you how do you icnu somebody but also help lead an
21:24
organization well and sometimes it's realizing hey those two things aren't going in the same direction actually going the opposite direction right great
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great question and I I think it's it's twofold one is if that person's going in
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a different direction and that's the direction God's calling them then it's not in their best interest to stay with
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your organization and I know that sounds a little piy or maybe I don't cliche or whatever but if I'm going into
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conversations like that and I'm pretty much convinced that this person's probably not best to stay in the role
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and in the place that they are right now if I can convince myself and remind myself that okay well God's got a plan
22:00
for their life uh it might not be what I thought it was going to be I need to help them find that plan even if it's
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not what I want them to which is really difficult it's not they're awful conversations I hate those kind of
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conversations but if I can convince myself this is still in their best interest makes those conversations so
22:17
much easier wow yeah so obviously those conversations aren't always easy even
Treating people well
22:22
after the fact when when you think through uh people leaving well and you
22:29
separating well with people how do you how do you treat somebody well on the way out great
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question I I think I always want people to leave and
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still say good things about us and maybe there's some selfishness in that there
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probably is but it feels like if if they're already going to leave you know that's going to happen you have their
22:52
best interest interest at heart you want you have the organization's best interest in heart in our case the church
22:58
then you really have nothing to gain other than them leaving and you
23:04
honoring them and them feeling good about what they experienced and you feeling good about what they experienced
23:09
and departing on good terms and that that can be that can be costly literally in dollars and cents it can be costly
23:17
from like an ego standpoint when you really like to tell somebody like what you're maybe really feeling right um so
23:23
it can be costly but I think it could be more costly if you choose the other way
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and and just kind of you know end in a way that's not honoring to them or the organization because it word gets out
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it's repeated and that that's not that doesn't serve anybody yeah so you're leading through all these various
Family
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scenarios The Good The Bad your family is along for the ride for in some
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respects what's that been like for them and how do you how do you lead them well
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but also let them lead well things that they're passionate about and not just be on the JN train it's a great question
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too you know I mean it it you have kids so you know it changes so much at the
24:05
different ages that they are along the way so when my kids were 10 and 12 we
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decided to move from the suburbs to the city we felt like God was calling us into the city to help start new churches
24:17
in the city and come alongside the good work that God was already doing and so that I knew was going to be a pivotal
24:23
moment for my kids and it's one that I still look back on occasionally okay was that was that the best thing for the
24:29
family was that how did that how did all that come together I I still think it was and we we called it an adventure
24:34
said you know we feel like God's wanting us to do this but you know it meant my kids leaving their friends it meant changing you know School situations it
24:41
meant leaving the large youth group that they had access to in the suburbs and comeing into the city where there was virtually nothing and so leading through
24:48
that was probably one of the biggest challenges I think from a family standpoint both my kids now look back
24:53
and are glad that we did and they would tell you that but that wasn't easy now they're 26 and 23 they both live in New
25:00
York you I was texting with my daughter on the way over here so I you know I think just open communication you know I
25:06
don't agree with all the things that they're doing and what they're saying necessarily but you know part of it I
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think is are they a reflection of me to a certain degree but you know God created
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them in His image not mine so you know what I mean and like I have to hold on to that Loosely and just recognize that
25:25
they're individuals God's going to walk them through whatever they're going through he's got them in their hands and
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just continue to pray and keep open lines of communication I feel like that maybe has been the one thing that's
25:38
helped us kind of get through tough times is always feeling like they could talk to me about whatever they wanted to
25:44
talk about right so for for people listening what
Advice
25:50
what's one thing you'd say from an advice standpoint that they could do that's actually actionable to be a
25:56
better servant leader good question in their life and their work okay in any
26:02
area all right the first thing that came to mind when you said that was apprenticeship and I think the idea uh
26:07
we think of leadership oftentimes as upfront big crowd uh that kind of
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leadership when I feel like the most effective and best leadership is apprentiship just oneon-one me bringing
26:19
somebody alongside me that I can you know develop challenge encourage to become the best leader that they could
26:25
become and we always talk about these five steps of apprenticeship maybe you've heard this before it's kind of
26:30
corny but it totally works it goes like this and I don't remember where we got this from I do you help we talk so
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whatever you're apprenticing someone in first I'm doing it you help me or no I'm sorry I do you watch it's the first one
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so you first you just observe just watch what I do could be anything right and then let's get together and talk about what we just experienced second step is
26:50
I do you help all right then I ask you to kind of get engaged let's give you a part of the leadership responsibility
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and then we get together and talk about it again right so I do you watch we talk I do you help we talk then it's you do I
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help we talk so I've switched now you're leading I'm helping you but we talk about what we're experiencing what's
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working what's not working how can we improve all right that's step three then step four is you do I watch now I'm just
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watching observing but we still get together and talk about what we're experiencing and then the last one is you do someone else watches and so you
27:20
start that whole process over again so it's five steps it's multiplying leadership but it's apprenticeship that's what apprenticeship looks like
27:26
bringing somebody alongside you and you observing and then helping and then me letting you lead I watch and then I or I
27:33
help and then I watch and then eventually you bring somebody else alongside you to Apprentice that that principle right there has been huge I
27:40
feel like for us for as long as I can remember that's good that's I'm I'm glad
Rapid Fire Questions
27:45
we're recording this because I'm going to rewatch this take some notes think about that with our team think about that with my family I mean with my kids
27:52
especially it's same thing stuff applies anywhere yeah yeah so one thing that's
27:58
uh that's tradition on this podcast that we're going to go through is to finish it off rapid fire questions I'm just
28:04
going to ask you 10 questions this is where it could get really dangerous and just first thing that comes to your mind this will be 60 seconds maybe maybe
28:12
slightly longer right let's go I'm ready so and some of these you might have already answered a little bit but first
28:17
person you think of when I say servant leadership first person I think of uh
28:22
Pat Ferguson wow is that your dad my mom oh your mom okay great yeah right on wow
28:30
okay five words that most describe yourself five words that describe me
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uh competitive intentional
28:42
determined likable conversational okay favorite author or book I have to go
28:49
with John Mark comr right now both of his most recent books are excellent ruthless elimination of hurry and I
28:54
can't remember his most recent title really really good yeah it was that good you clearly remember so good I can't
29:00
remember the title favorite movie favorite movie you know I I just saw a
29:06
man called aotto and I thought it was really interesting and good it's not is that one with Tom Hanks Tom yeah you
29:11
can't really go wrong Tom Hanks is almost always good so yeah favorite food favorite food pizza I can eat pizza
29:17
anytime anywhere not cold though it's got to be hot what kind cheese pepperoni no okay this is see pepperoni P that's
29:24
that's the way to eat pizza I don't eat pork or beef okay so sadly spinach pizza spinach pizza oh
29:32
okay y yeah okay and I admit that's not as good as pepperon do not no pizza is meant to be had with pepperon so this
29:38
isn't rapid fire question but you're a pastor in Chicago M Lum natis giordanos
29:44
goo's East no Unos what's the best Chicago deep dish for everyone watching Chicago deep Chicago deep dish um oh my
29:52
good is pads for sure yeah yeah in theads P quads on Kor yeah they have like that uh crazy crust they actually
29:59
line the pan with cheese and it kind of um gets crispy and us there's always
30:05
like a two hour weight though I've only had it one time crazy yeah yeah it's crazy weight um favorite thing you do in your free time favorite thing I do in my
30:12
free time read okay surprising fact about you surprising fact about me yes I
30:19
was born in Mexico wow that is surprising yes okay Mexico
30:26
Missouri okay true it's a town in in Missouri called Mexico that's where I was born I like that U favorite place
30:33
you've been oh wow you know what okay so this was a pasture perk I actually had a
30:38
destination wedding this past summer somebody asked me to do their wedding oh wow and it was in Italy it was amazing wow yeah it was so great that's awesome
30:45
super fun so I love Italy just about anywhere in Italy place you want to go that you haven't been to before I think
30:51
I would I want to go to Israel had not been to Israel yet okay yeah for sure will you get there soon as a matter of
30:56
fact my wife and I were talking about it just the last couple of days we'd like to in I think it's probably going to be 2024 cool if we could pull it off yeah
31:04
cool that'd be great all right last rapid fire question best advice you've ever gotten best advice I've ever
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gotten seek first to understand before seeking to be understood that's good wow well thank
31:18
you so much for being on the podcast super appreciate you and excited for everyone to go read more of your books
31:24
all of them tell us real quick about your most recent book or one the books you think people should read for sure uh
31:30
uh bless five everyday ways to love your neighbor and change the world uh what we found is that a lot of folks like you
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and me Chris even if we grew up in the church followed Jesus for quite some time when it came to sharing the love of
31:41
Jesus with people it just felt awkward or maybe like a bad sales pitch and so
31:46
what we discovered is that the best way to love people is to bless them and uh you know God told Abraham you were here
31:51
to bless the world and that theme of blessing goes all the way through scripture you look at Jesus said and in
31:57
the Beatitudes these are the the Blessed people when children came to him what did he do he blessed them so over and over again Jesus was constantly blessing
32:02
people and so bless is in a crosstick I won't tell you what it is buy the book and you find what the cross is but it's
32:08
super simple practical ways that you can actually show the love of Jesus to your neighbors and friends and it's it's
32:14
really fun to see people picking it up and putting to work and lives are changing cool bless db. org how about
32:19
that that's perfect thank you so much for being on my pleasure thanks a lot for asking thank you for listening to this episode of the servant leadership
32:27
podcast if you enjoyed what you heard please give it a thumbs up and leave a comment below don't forget to subscribe
32:35
and hit the notification Bell to never miss an update be sure to check out the servant leadership podcast. org for more
32:41
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