Today on the Servant Leadership Podcast, we welcome Brian Mueller, President of Grand Canyon University — the largest Christian university in the world. Brian’s path to leading GCU is one of the most unlikely stories in American higher education. A high school teacher and basketball coach turned tech-driven education executive, Brian first helped grow the University of Phoenix to 400,000 students and a $16 billion market cap. After his success at the University of Phoenix, he decided to go to Grand Canyon University, which at the time was a struggling Christian university $20 million in debt, with fewer than 1,000 students, in one of the toughest neighborhoods in Phoenix. Today, GCU has grown to over 100,000 students and invested over 2 billion dollars into the campus, which ranks among the most beautiful in the country — all while holding tuition flat for the last 17 years. What makes Brian’s story truly remarkable isn’t the growth, it’s the why behind it. From producing 26,000 teachers and the largest nursing program in the country, to rehabbing over 600 homes and awarding 2,300 full-ride scholarships to local kids living below the poverty line, GCU has become inseparable from the community it serves. Join us as we talk about what happens when you build a university around untapped potential, why every vocation is a sacred calling, and hear how vision is one of the most important traits a leader can have.
Episode Transcript
AI and Global Productivity
0:00
AI is coming along at a time when there
0:02
are 8 billion people in the world and
0:05
what we should be able to do to increase
0:07
the productivity of people in
0:09
organizations using AI should be
0:12
transformational.
0:13
You know, we should be getting more out
0:15
of the ground so everybody’s got enough
0:17
food to eat. The problem with AI is that
0:19
people are selfish and if we let the
0:21
selfish people dictate the direction it
0:23
moves, it’ll be a disaster.
Introducing Brian Mueller
0:31
Today on the Servant Leadership Podcast,
0:33
we welcome Brian Mueller, president of
0:35
Grand Canyon University, the largest
0:38
Christian university in the world.
0:40
Brian’s path to leading GCU is one of
0:42
the most unlikely stories in American
0:44
higher education. A high school teacher
0:46
and basketball coach turned techdriven
0:48
education executive, Brian first helped
0:51
grow the University of Phoenix to
0:53
400,000 students and a 16 billion market
0:56
cap. After his success at the University
0:58
of Phoenix, he decided to go to Grand
1:00
Canyon University, which at the time was
1:02
a struggling Christian university, $20
1:04
million in debt with fewer than 1,000
1:07
students in one of the toughest
1:08
neighborhoods in Phoenix. Today, GCU has
1:11
grown to over 100,000 students and
1:13
invested over $2 billion into the
1:16
campus, which ranks among the most
1:17
beautiful in the country, all while
1:19
holding tuition flat for the last 17
1:21
years. What makes Brian’s story truly
1:23
remarkable isn’t the growth, it’s the
1:26
why behind it. From producing 26,000
1:28
teachers and the largest nursing program
1:30
in the country to rehabbing over 600
1:33
homes and awarding 2,300 full ride
1:35
scholarships to local kids living below
1:37
the poverty line, GCU has become
1:40
inseparable from the community it
1:41
serves. Join us as we talk about what
1:43
happens when you build a university
1:45
around untapped potential, why every
1:47
vocation is a sacred calling, and hear
1:49
how vision is one of the most important
1:50
traits a leader can have.
Brian’s Journey to GCU
1:52
Brian, thank you for being on the
1:53
servant leadership podcast.
1:55
Thanks for having me. This is this is
1:56
very exciting. Congratulations on
1:58
everything that you’ve done cuz it’s
1:59
it’s been remarkable and so we’re happy
2:02
to participate in that.
2:03
Yeah, this is amazing. So, I first heard
2:06
your story or the school story really
2:08
from a donor of yours and I was
2:11
fascinated because this school has had a
2:14
long history uh an unbelievable history
2:16
but you yourself came into this role
2:19
with a crazy journey to get here. Talk
2:21
about your role becoming the leader here
2:23
at GCU. Yeah, I tell our students all
2:26
the time, you know, where whatever you
2:28
think you’re going to be doing when
2:29
you’re 72 years old, like me, when
2:31
you’re 22 and graduating from college,
2:33
it’s probably not going to be even close
2:35
to what you’re thinking today. Uh, life
2:37
is absolutely an adventure. And I had no
2:39
aspirations to be a college president or
2:41
to read a to lead a publicly traded
2:43
company. Um, I graduated from high
2:45
school having a great experience. I um I
2:48
loved my classes. I loved uh playing
2:51
sports, playing basketball and baseball,
2:52
and I want to be a high school teacher.
2:54
Uh so I went to a small Christian
2:56
college in order to prepare to be a
2:57
secondary high school high school
2:59
teacher and uh I taught for seven years
3:01
two in Michigan and five in Colorado and
3:02
I taught psychology, sociology, world
3:04
history, theology. I was a fanatical
3:06
basketball coach. Had a good program in
3:08
Denver and then went back to my alma
3:10
mater Concordia in in Nebraska and was
3:12
their basketball coach for four years
3:13
and and taught in the education
3:15
department. Moved to Arizona because I
3:17
wanted to finish a PhD program at ASU.
3:19
My wife is a native of Arizona. I love
3:21
Arizona. One thing led to another and
3:23
and uh after 11 years of teaching and
3:25
coaching uh I was married and had
3:27
married way over my head. We were living
3:29
with my brother-in-law in a 12,200 foot
3:31
house. He had two uh 10 years younger
3:33
than us. He had two pitbulls and I had a
3:36
wife and three kids. And I came home
3:38
towards the end of my second semester. I
3:39
was teaching philosophy as part of a
3:41
humanities class at ASU making $5,000 a
3:44
semester. Things weren’t really looking
3:46
very good. Uh and my wife said, “I have
3:48
a surprise for you. We need to talk.”
3:49
And I was got real nervous about that.
3:51
And as it turned out, she said, “It’s
3:53
probably not what you think. Um, we have
3:55
we’re going to have our fourth child.”
3:58
And it was like my my life passed right
4:00
in front of me. And I thought, “Man,
4:02
your plan is not working.” Uh, and so I
4:05
wandered into the University of Phoenix
4:07
uh in in um 19 I think 87. Uh they were
4:12
just getting started. I I I uh and I
4:16
never intended to stay there. They
4:18
offered me a job. I’m not good at most
4:20
things in life, but they had me
4:21
recruiting students, and I was really
4:22
good at that. And one thing led to
4:24
another, and I really started to like
4:26
what they were doing. It was this new
4:28
market in higher education that was
4:29
emerging, teaching 32-year-old students
4:32
who want to go back to college while
4:33
they’re raising families and building
4:35
careers, earning bachelors, masters, and
4:37
doctoral degrees. We had a specific
4:39
model for how we were teaching those
4:40
students. That was really attractive. It
4:43
was really effective. And uh I I uh
4:47
eventually they said, “Would you go out
4:48
and run our campus in New Mexico?” Which
4:50
I did. That went really well. Then they
4:52
said, “Go out and run our campus in San
4:54
Diego,” which I did. That went really
4:55
well. So I’m building and we’re growing.
4:58
And then they called 10 years after I
5:00
started in 1998 and they said, “You know
5:02
what? This thing Al Gore has done almost
5:03
single-handedly, this internet that he’s
5:05
created, uh we think the next big
5:07
application of the internet might be
5:09
higher education and we’d like to you to
5:11
take charge of that and help us think
5:12
about that.” I’m the least technical
5:15
person in the world, but I wanted to
5:16
move back to Arizona. I love Arizona. Uh
5:19
and so I said, “Okay.” And and uh so we
5:21
can’t. And that started this odyssey of
5:24
can we teach effectively at a distance?
5:26
Can we teach online? And uh we stuck
5:30
with our learning model, how how adults
5:32
best learn. Uh adult students,
5:34
practitioner, faculty members,
5:35
applicationbased curriculum, big focus
5:37
on writing, critical thinking, problem
5:39
solving. uh we were having tremendous
5:43
impact all over the country doing that
5:46
in physical brick-andmortar locations
5:48
and I thought let’s not change anything.
5:50
Let’s bring the faculty and the students
5:52
together on the internet and let’s keep
5:54
everything else the same. And after a
5:56
couple years I went to our CEO and I
5:58
said you know we’ve got the tiger by the
6:00
tail here. Nobody thinks we can do this
6:01
or should be doing this and I’m telling
6:03
you we can do it and we can do it
6:05
tremendously effectively.
6:07
He said what do you need? I said
6:09
capital. We need access to capital. We
6:10
need to build this thing out. Well, he
6:12
had the idea of going to p to pitch our
6:14
idea in the public markets. I’m a
6:16
history teacher, theology teacher. I’ve
6:18
never taken a business class in my life.
6:20
But here we are out there pitching our
6:22
idea to Wall Street. And Wall Street
6:23
loved our idea. They invested hundreds
6:26
of millions of dollars into it. We are
6:28
building technology like you can’t
6:30
believe. We’re hiring 400 people a
6:32
quarter. We grew from a couple thousand
6:34
students to 200,000 students between
6:37
2000 2006. and and this whole thing is
6:40
being run by a history teacher and a
6:42
basketball coach, which is the
6:43
unbelievable irony of the whole thing.
6:45
But as a result of that, they said,
6:47
“We’d like to make you CEO of the entire
6:49
company.” And so I’m running this 16.2
6:51
billion market cap company. Uh, and we
6:55
we built it to 400,000 students. And
6:57
three years after they made me the CEO,
6:59
they Grand Canyon called and said,
7:01
“Would you be interested in coming to
7:03
Grand Canyon University?” And I I
7:06
thought probably not. But um the more I
7:10
thought about it, the more I thought,
7:11
you know, my early life has all been
7:13
about Christian education. As an
7:15
elementary school student, high school
7:16
student, university uh uh student, and
7:18
then a high school teacher, university
7:20
professor, a basketball coach. Higher
7:23
education is getting unaccessible to the
7:26
majority of Americans. maybe we’ve
7:28
learned some things uh that we could use
7:31
to completely flip the script and make
7:34
it affordable to all socioeconomic
7:36
classes of Americans. And so we come we
7:38
came over here, we walked the campus, it
7:40
was less than a thousand students. It
7:42
was uh $20 million in debt. It buildings
7:45
had been built shortly after World War
7:46
II. 33rd Avenue in Camelback was the
7:49
worst criminal crime place in the city
7:51
of Phoenix.
Decision to Lead GCU
7:54
Why would we leave all this? But you
7:56
know, it was like maybe God has put this
7:58
plan in place from the beginning. And so
8:01
we decided to come and we came in 2008.
8:04
We told the board we wanted to do
8:06
something big, which means we had to go
8:07
to the public markets. If you remember
8:09
2008, that was not the time to go to the
8:11
public markets. We came here in June. By
8:13
November, it’s a disaster. I told my my
8:16
my friend, I said, “Listen, don’t tell
8:18
our wives anything about this, anything
8:20
about what we’ve done here.” Um, but we
8:22
went out in November and we’re pitching
8:24
an idea about building a Christian
8:26
university in Phoenix, Arizona, when
8:28
there had not been an IPO out on Wall
8:30
Street for 90 days, longest streak in
8:32
the history of Wall Street. Um, I don’t
8:34
know how we got it out, but we did. Uh,
8:37
the stock got out of $12. That gave us
8:39
$254 million. We brought that back to
8:41
Phoenix. And the idea is there’s two
8:43
major markets in higher ed. We’re going
8:45
to have large growing student bodies in
8:47
both major markets. So, we’re going to
8:49
start with the online program and we’re
8:50
going to build that. And for three
8:52
years, we did that and that started to
8:54
really take traction and it was
8:56
profitable. So, we started to pour money
8:58
into the campus. So, on our campus,
9:00
we’ve got 18-year-old students leaving
9:02
high school, going to college, and have
9:03
that experience like you did and I did.
9:05
Our online campus is for working adults.
9:07
But, if we had two large student bodies
9:09
leveraging a common infrastructure, we
9:11
think we thought we could flip the
9:12
economics. It’s worked out way better
9:13
than we could ever imagined. Um, you
9:16
know, we built a campus of 25,000
9:17
students. We’re on our way to 50,000
9:19
students. Our online campus is 108,000
9:22
students. We have now building hybrid
9:24
campuses throughout the country.
9:26
Eventually, 80 of them. We’ve got 47 of
9:28
them stood up where we’re going to do
9:30
hybrid learning, things like nursing
9:32
where some of the learning can be done
9:33
online, some has to be done in a
9:34
physical brick and motor uh uh
9:36
laboratory setting. That’s got 7,000
9:39
students on its way to 48,000 students.
9:41
Um, God has blessed this in a way that
9:44
we could never have imagined. I thought
9:45
we had a good idea. I could have never
9:48
predicted this.
Challenges and Opportunities
9:49
Wow. It is such a crazy story. And one
9:51
of the things that I find fascinating is
9:54
you were at the top of your game before
9:55
you came here. And and now when people
9:58
look at your role at GCU, it’s like a
10:00
dream job for any college president. Uh,
10:03
but when you came here, you talked about
10:05
a thousand students or so, 20 million in
10:07
debt. This was not the dream job, right?
10:10
this was this is going to be a big
10:12
project. Talk about how you even came to
10:15
the decision of I’m going to come in and
10:17
do this again. And then obviously we
10:20
talk a lot about servant leadership. I
10:22
mean that’s a big servant leadership
10:23
move to to be able to humble yourself to
10:25
come take this role and then try to
10:27
bring everyone up with you. Talk about
10:29
that experience. You know, the the the
10:31
Bible is full of
10:34
examples of of how God uses people in
10:38
ways that they would never have
10:39
imagined.
10:40
You know, it it’s just that that’s the
10:42
story of the Bible. Uh God taking Moses
10:45
and saying, “Yes, you can do it, and I’m
10:47
going to give you the I’m going to help
10:49
you. You can speak, and you’re going to
10:50
make it, and you can do it.” Uh you can
10:53
go through all the other examples, and
10:54
it’s that’s kind of how it is. you know,
10:56
I I wanted to be a high school teacher
10:58
and a basketball coach and and I was
11:00
going down that track. Eventually, I
11:01
wanted to be a university professor and
11:03
basketball coach. Um, but he had I tell
11:06
our students all the time, uh, if you
11:08
want to give God a good laugh, tell him
11:10
what your plans are. Uh, because he’s
11:12
got his own plans for us. It was 57. I
11:15
was 57 when we came here. And uh I
11:18
thought, you know, it’s pretty clear to
11:21
me that we’ve learned two things uh that
11:23
we could have never learned in a PhD
11:25
program. How to use the public markets
11:26
to get access to capital and how to use
11:29
the internet to reach the world.
11:30
Those two things weren’t being taught
11:32
anywhere. But we learned those things by
11:34
doing them. And then this thing, Grand
11:36
Canyon University in it was always a
11:38
great place. It was a small private
11:40
college with great programs and
11:41
education and business and small college
11:44
athletics and fine art. It was always a
11:45
great place, but always struggling
11:47
financially, always on the verge of of
11:48
of closing, which a lot of Christian
11:50
universities are.
11:51
Yes.
11:52
But the fact that it was 20 minutes away
11:54
from where we learned all those things
11:56
is is that’s that’s providential. That’s
11:00
divine intervention. That was part of
11:02
God’s plan. There was no question about
11:04
that. I could have never done this by
11:06
myself. If I had to take, you know, a
11:08
thousand people or and tell them, you
11:10
know, we’re going to move to Lincoln,
11:12
Nebraska or someplace else to do this.
11:13
there’s it was 20 minutes away
11:16
and so uh it was yes there was a lot of
11:20
risk there was a lot of risk we were
11:21
going to try to do something that was I
11:23
I wanted to create something where where
11:26
where where families would have the
11:28
opportunity to send their sons or
11:30
daughters and and have them be involved
11:32
in a very rigorous academic experience
11:34
but one that was rooted in the truth
11:36
about the world
11:37
the biblical narrative of of of of
11:39
creation fall redemption restoration
11:42
because those are the two things, the
11:44
free market system and the and the
11:46
Christian worldview perspective that
11:47
created the most prosperity in the
11:49
history of the world. Now, there’s a
11:50
there’s another part to this whole
11:52
thing, which is this neighborhood, but I
11:53
I’ll I’ll wait on that. Um, no, it’s
11:56
it’s it it did take some amount of
11:59
courage and a willingness to take a
12:01
risk. There’s no question about that.
12:03
But the other side of that is uh God has
12:06
been part of this thing. There is no
12:08
question about that. There’s just too
12:10
many things that came together to make
12:13
this work that
12:14
is more than coincidence.
Innovative Education Models
12:16
Yeah. And later I do want to talk about
12:18
the neighborhood. But one thing I’m
12:20
curious about the two things that are
12:22
very different and obviously GCU has
12:24
become the largest Christian university
12:26
in the world. Something that is
12:27
interesting to me is you have the public
12:30
market aspect and you’ve got the online
12:33
uh education. Both of those seem like
12:37
things that are crazy in this world,
12:40
right? People probably thought you were
12:41
out of your mind when you’re doing this.
12:43
Talk about why people are so against it.
12:46
And then also how you’ve seen it be such
12:48
a benefit and not that they’re against
12:50
it, but just why more schools don’t do
12:51
it. It seems like you’ve proven the
12:53
model so well.
12:55
You know, it is interesting. The that
12:57
whole thing is very interesting. There’s
12:59
so much there’s so much tradition to
13:01
higher education. There are so many
13:04
traditional thoughts about it. The you
13:06
know the the system is set up in a way
13:09
to reward some things and not others. US
13:11
News and World Report rankings are
13:13
probably the worst thing out there in
13:15
terms of universities really achieving
13:18
the kinds of things they should achieve
13:20
because so much so many measurements
13:22
don’t have anything to do you know when
13:24
you read the four gospels you know and u
13:27
Jesus saw untapped potential everywhere.
13:31
He saw untapped potential in the 12
13:34
people he chose to be his followers.
13:36
You know, uh so many of the people that
13:38
end up participating with him and being
13:40
part of his miraculous work with human
13:43
beings and and that’s what exists in
13:46
America. and and it there’s there’s vast
13:50
amounts of untapped potential in America
13:53
today because universities won’t think
13:56
creatively about how to help people uh
13:00
move towards their potential by
13:02
enrolling and participating in college
13:06
post-secary education because
13:08
universities want to deliver it on their
13:10
terms not the students terms. I I’ll
13:13
give you one good example. We have a we
13:15
have a a we have a tremendous shortage
13:17
of of teachers in this country and and
13:19
it’s and that’s a real threat to the
13:21
country and and it’s the university’s
13:23
fault because they’re waiting for 17
13:25
year olds to make a decision to become a
13:26
teacher, go to college for four years,
13:28
then step into the classroom. There’s
13:30
nothing wrong with that, but if that’s
13:31
how you see it, your your market’s this
13:34
big. We went to the New York public
13:36
school district and said, you know, you
13:37
got pair of professionals that walk
13:39
through your uh uh buildings every
13:41
single day. Many of them are single
13:43
mothers. They’re they’re making 15 or
13:44
$20,000 a year. Their kids are going to
13:46
the school. They have the same hours as
13:48
their kids’ hours, which is why they’re
13:49
doing it. But you can tell whether they
13:52
do they show up on time, do they dress
13:53
professionally? Do they get along with
13:55
kids? That’s untapped potential. If we
13:57
could deliver the education into your
13:59
school district so they could become
14:02
licensed teachers, that’s the future of
14:04
your teaching force.
14:05
We’ve got 10,000 students in that
14:07
program. Now, pair of professionals all
14:09
over the country uh in school districts
14:11
in Chicago and Philadelphia and
14:13
Milwaukee and um and uh New York and
14:16
Pittsburgh and we just signed deals in
14:18
LA and Miami date county. A Christian
14:21
university in Phoenix, Arizona is
14:23
helping major public school districts
14:26
all over the country fulfill their
14:27
biggest need, which is the shortage of
14:29
teachers. But we have to deliver the
14:31
education to those young people. I when
14:33
I say young, a lot of them are 23 or 24
14:35
years old. uh that that can in ways that
14:39
they can consume it which is which is at
14:41
a distance but we’re we’re the reason
14:45
we’re building those 80 locations those
14:47
hybrid campuses there’s a nursing
14:49
shortage that’s the dumbest thing I’ve
14:51
ever heard nursing is a great occupation
14:54
it’s a ticket into the middle class it
14:56
involves serving other people in in in
14:59
in and so why is there a nursing
15:02
shortage universities keep their nursing
15:04
programs very small they They want elite
15:07
statistics in terms of enllex
15:09
examination pass rates. Uh and they
15:12
don’t want to lose. They don’t want to
15:13
lose a lot of money. Nursing programs
15:14
lose money. Um we’re going to have the
15:17
we have the largest nursing program in
15:19
the country. And it’s going to be by far
15:20
the when we get 80 locations built. We
15:23
got 47 uh of them up. There’ll be 600
15:26
students per location. That’s another
15:28
48,000 students. We’re producing 90
15:30
plus% u pass rate, first time pass rates
15:33
on the ENLEX exam. And we’re giving
15:35
people all young people all over the
15:37
country to get a chance to get into a
15:39
middle class occupation that could
15:41
become an upper middle class uh
15:43
occupation and then they can fulfill
15:46
their god-given responsibility which is
15:48
to take the gospel into the workplace.
15:51
Um, but it’s it’s the unwillingness of
15:55
of of provost and deans and faculty
15:59
members to see their the the potential
16:02
they have if they’re willing to be
16:04
creative about how to deliver this and
16:06
help people realize their God-given
16:08
potential.
Future of Education and AI
16:09
Wow. I love that. You know, it it makes
16:12
me think my wife and I, we have young
16:13
kids and we’re talking about what do we
16:15
do with our kids’ education and all that
16:17
and we’re seeing just the drastic
16:19
changes in society with AI and other
16:21
things. How does a school like this that
16:23
has always been on the forefront of
16:25
helping other schools empower other
16:28
schools and empower districts and
16:29
whatnot move into the future? How are
16:32
you starting to think about that?
16:34
AI is I think uh you know when you think
16:38
about the biblical narrative of of
16:40
creation, fall, redemption, restoration,
16:43
the world’s been redeemed.
16:47
Jesus is going to come back at some
16:49
point and make it all right. He’s going
16:50
to restore the whole thing. But in this
16:53
period of restoration, he’s counting on
16:55
his church, his people to make the world
16:58
a better place. John 3:16 starts out
17:01
with, “For God so love God loves the
17:04
world. It’s fallen. There’s a lot of
17:06
evil. There’s a lot of there’s there’s a
17:08
lot of hardship, but he still loves the
17:10
world, and he doesn’t like to see people
17:12
hungry or without a place to live or
17:15
without a a future to take care of their
17:17
family.” Um, and when you when you think
17:21
about it from that standpoint,
17:24
AI is coming along at a time when there
17:26
are 8 billion people in the world. And
17:29
what we should be able to do to increase
17:32
the productivity of people in
17:33
organizations using AI should be
17:36
transformational.
17:38
You know, we should be getting more out
17:39
of the ground so everybody’s got enough
17:41
food to eat. We should be able to build
17:43
houses for $10,000 so everybody has a
17:45
place to live. We should come up with
17:47
new forms of transportation so people
17:49
can get around.
17:51
AI could really propel this world in a
17:54
direction that could be unbelievably
17:57
positive.
17:58
But but it’s going to be it’s going to
18:00
have to be managed by the church, by
18:02
Christians, by Christian universities,
18:04
by Christian schools. Uh we now have a
18:07
master’s degree program in AI, a baloria
18:09
program in AI, a certificate program in
18:11
AI. But most importantly, we’re
18:14
integrating, we’ve integrated the
18:16
Christian worldview perspective across
18:17
all of our colleges and all of our
18:19
programs, most of our classes. We’ve
18:21
interviewed we’ve integrated free market
18:23
thinking. Now, we’re in the process of
18:26
integrating AI so that every student
18:29
that graduates knows how to use AI to be
18:32
a more productive teacher, a more
18:34
productive nurse, a more productive
18:36
engineer, a more productive computer
18:38
scientist. We’ve got to grab hold of
18:40
this opportunity here and we’ve got to
18:44
help people learn how to integrate it to
18:47
become more productive, more efficient.
18:50
And we a couple years ago rewrote our
18:52
mission statement and it finishes out by
18:54
saying we want to create human
18:56
flourishing by putting the needs of
18:58
others in front of our own. The problem
19:00
with AI is that people are selfish and
19:02
if we let the selfish people dictate the
19:05
direction it moves, it’ll be a disaster.
19:08
But if we if we get AI into the
19:13
into the Christian schools especially
19:15
and into the churches so that we’ve got
19:18
people who are willing to use this
19:20
incredible technology
19:22
to put the needs of others in front of
19:24
their own and create prosperity for
19:26
everybody. We’re sitting on the
19:28
precipice of now. We’re excited in
19:30
Arizona because Phoenix, the Arizona is
19:33
going to have one of the most dynamic
19:36
economies in the world going forward,
19:38
what’s going to happen here in the next
19:40
10 years. And I spoke at the legislature
19:42
a couple weeks ago. They asked me to
19:43
speak speak at the at the opening
19:45
orientation and I said, “You know what
19:46
you guys should be focused on? You guys
19:48
should be singularly focused on one
19:50
thing. how to take as many young people
19:53
as we possibly can whose families have
19:55
been living below the poverty line and
19:57
move them into a middle class job that
19:59
could become an upper middle class job
20:01
in the 10 next 10 years.
20:03
You know, Lyndon Johnson, the great
20:04
society, the war on poverty, the welfare
20:06
system, if you wanted to keep minorities
20:08
and poor populations poor, you would
20:09
create a welfare system because it
20:11
creates dependency. In the next 10
20:13
years, what we can do in Arizona because
20:15
of the explosion of the economy and the
20:18
fact that there the the supply and
20:20
demand of the labor force is flipped uh
20:22
is that we need to get as many there
20:25
there there’s more demand than there is
20:26
supply. That means these kids that are
20:29
living in our neighborhood and going to
20:31
high school in our neighborhood should
20:33
have the opportunity when they graduate
20:34
from high school to as soon as possible
20:36
get into a middle class job. That will
20:39
take care of 90% of your problems. They
20:41
were talking to me about Medicaid. I
20:42
said Medicaid is very
Work and Community Impact
22:44
easy. You got too
22:46
many people who are getting benefits
22:49
that aren’t paying into it. You put
22:52
everybody to work uh which is God what
22:53
God intended in the first place, right?
22:55
He put Adam in the garden to work the
22:57
garden. That was part of the plan from
22:59
the beginning. We get everybody to go to
23:01
work and get them into middle class
23:03
jobs. It’ll take care of 90% of our
23:05
problems.
Job Passion and Community
23:05
Well, I I think it’s interesting. A lot
23:08
of people are working in jobs that
23:09
they’re that they’re passionate about or
23:12
that they at least enjoy. Um, and
23:14
they’re so focused on that job that they
23:16
miss the community around them and the
23:17
impact they could have. One of the
23:20
things that I see schools doing, uh, is
23:22
that same thing. GCU is kind of taking
23:24
the opposite approach. Uh, you guys have
23:26
invested a ton and are investing a ton
23:29
in the community around you. Talk about
23:30
that and why that’s important because it
23:32
really sets up what you’re talking about
23:33
for the future to be better for
23:35
everybody. Yeah, you know, that was that
23:38
was part of this whole plan that is that
23:40
was just it was providential. There’s no
23:42
question about it. Uh this place was 20
23:44
minutes away from where we had learned
23:46
all those things. And I I probably a
23:48
thousand people left that place and came
23:49
over here over the course of the last 11
23:51
or 12 years. There were a hundred of
23:53
them that were really key. Um and and I
23:55
could have never done this by myself. Um
23:58
it was way too big an undertaking. Um
Community Investment Success
24:03
but um so after we we got here in 2008,
24:05
by 2011 we were starting to see that
24:06
this might work.
24:08
You know, we took that capital, we were
24:10
putting it to use, and this was and it
24:12
was like, wow.
24:14
None of us are commercial real estate
24:15
people, but most commercial real estate
24:17
people would say, you don’t build a $2
24:19
billion campus, which we have here. It’s
24:21
ranked the 20th nice campus in the
24:23
country now. Um, you don’t build a $2
24:25
billion campus in Mville, the Canyon
24:28
Corridor, West Phoenix, you go to
24:30
Scottsdale or Paradise Valley or Gilbert
24:31
or any of these great maybe maybe
24:34
California, maybe Jerry Creek, Colorado,
24:35
I don’t know, but you don’t build it
24:36
here.
Jesus and Community
24:38
And we thought, you know, maybe if Jesus
24:40
came back today,
24:42
he’d probably come to a place like this.
24:44
He tended to gravitate towards people
24:46
that were hurting. There are 72
24:48
different languages that get spoke to
24:49
within 10 square miles of this place.
24:51
God’s brought the world to us. I tell
24:53
our students all the time, I completely
24:54
supportive of international mission
24:56
trips, but understand God’s bringing the
24:59
world to us. They’re all over the place,
25:01
from Africa, from the Middle East, from
25:05
Central and South America. And so,
25:06
we’re doing it here.
Five-Point Community Plan
25:09
We’re planting our flag here. And we
25:11
started to pour money into this campus
25:15
and it started to grow. And we said, you
25:17
know, we we’re going to I think what we
25:19
need to do is something that government
25:21
can’t do. Uh if you go back to the early
25:23
60s and Lyndon Johnson, the Great
25:24
Society, the war on poverty, the welfare
25:26
system, 14% of Americans live below a
25:28
poverty line. Today, 14% of Americans
25:30
live below poverty line. It hasn’t cut
25:31
into it at all.
25:33
But if you put a free market entity with
25:35
a Christian worldview perspective in the
25:37
middle of a neighborhood like this, I
25:39
wonder what might happen. So, we put
25:40
together a five-point plan and we said
25:42
the number one, the first thing a
25:44
neighborhood needs like this is jobs. Uh
25:46
we’ve created 16,000 jobs since we got
25:49
here. Uh we’ve started uh we spun 10
25:51
businesses off of this one which just
25:54
created another 600 jobs. We hire people
25:55
in the neighborhood. It gives them a
25:57
salary. It gives them benefits. They can
25:58
send their kids to college for free.
26:00
It’s a reason to live in this
26:01
neighborhood and to prosper in this
26:03
neighborhood. Um and we’re continuing to
26:05
spin businesses off of this one. We have
26:07
a business incubation center on the east
26:09
side of our campus that has 16 new
26:11
businesses incubating right now which we
26:12
want to move into the neighborhood to
26:14
create more jobs. The first thing a
26:16
place like thing this this place needs
26:18
is jobs. The second thing it needs is
26:20
safety. Uh we we work with the city of
26:22
Phoenix police. We have our own police
26:24
department. 27th Avenue was the worst
26:25
place in the city of Phoenix.
26:27
Prostitution, drugs, pimps, criminal
26:30
activity. Uh we are working like crazy.
26:32
Four mile stretch between what we call
26:35
Indian School and Northern. And um you
26:36
know the book of John tells us what
26:39
Christians should do what? Bring light
26:44
into the darkest places. Um and u we are
26:46
we are getting the criminal activity out
26:48
of this neighborhood. Our campus is safe
26:49
because we have our own police force.
26:51
But we want the neighborhood to be safe
26:52
for the people who live here so they can
26:54
stay here and prosper here. And we are
26:57
going to get it done. I mean what you’re
26:58
going to see on 27th Avenue in the next
26:59
four or five years is going to be
27:01
literally unbelievable. We’re going to
27:03
take it from the darkest place in the
27:04
city of Phoenix and make it the lightest
27:06
place in the city of Phoenix to show
27:10
people what Jesus can do um uh in terms
27:12
of bringing light into darkness. So,
27:14
that’s the second thing is safety. The
27:15
third thing is homes. We have the
27:16
largest Habitat for Humanity program in
27:18
the world going on here. Uh we’ve
27:21
rehabbed over now 600 homes. Uh and
27:22
we’re just going to keep going. The
27:25
fourth thing is students. Um we’re
27:27
getting kids from all 50 states. They’re
27:29
coming from everywhere, but we’re not
27:30
leaving the kids in this neighborhood
27:32
behind. So, we’ve raised over $20
27:35
million to award uh over now 2,300 full
27:37
ride scholarships to kids that come
27:39
right out of this neighborhood. 95% of
27:41
them are minority kids that live below
27:42
the poverty line, but their average
27:45
incoming GPA now are nearly 4.0. So, the
27:48
word’s gotten out that if you do well in
27:49
high school, you have a chance to stay
27:51
right in your neighborhood, go to
27:53
college, become an engineer, become a
27:55
computer scientist, become a nurse,
27:57
become a teacher, whatever. and we’re
27:58
just going to keep going with that
28:00
scholarship program and those
28:01
opportunities for these kids right in
28:03
this neighborhood. The fifth thing is
28:04
called thing called City Serve. I won’t
28:06
go into the detail of it, but we have
28:09
contracts with Walmart, Target, uh
28:12
Amazon, Costco, major retailers. They
28:13
sell goods into the marketplace. A
28:16
percent gets returned, can’t be resold.
28:17
That stuff was being put on trucks and
28:20
taken to landfills. It’s now getting on
28:22
trucks and and being brought here to our
28:25
city serve 100,000 square foot uh
28:28
warehouse. Uh we’ve got people over
28:29
there that uh take the stuff off the
28:31
trucks, inventory it, put it up on
28:34
racks. We have over now 200 pods, points
28:36
of distribution, inner city churches
28:38
throughout Arizona. They identify the
28:41
needs in their comm in their community
28:43
and it’s household goods, tables,
28:45
chairs, couches, uh microwaves,
28:48
refrigerators, uh it’s unbelievable this
28:51
um and we’ve gotten over $18 million now
28:54
worth of brand new goods to over 70,000
28:58
families in Arizona in just last less
28:58
than four years.
Impact of City Serve
29:01
Wow.
29:01
Um and it’s incredible. It’s an
29:04
incredible ministry because the people
29:06
Why are you doing this? I had I had an
29:09
empty apartment and the apartment’s now
29:11
completely furnished. It didn’t cost me
29:13
anything, you know, and that’s when you
29:15
talk about the gospel. So that
29:18
five-point plan has spurred now a
29:20
hundred other ministries. Our students
29:22
now go into the neighborhood Monday
29:25
through Friday in the evenings and they
29:28
go into Syrian refugee apartment place
29:30
or some or uh something from the condo
29:32
and they help kids with their homework
29:34
and teach them English as a second
29:36
language. We just had a Muslim community
29:39
about a mile from here who our kids have
29:41
been working with their kids for about
29:43
three years. They just brought the
29:45
entire community to one of our chapel
29:47
services to hear the gospel.
29:48
Wow.
29:49
That’s kind of a miracle.
29:52
That is kind of a miracle. But you can’t
29:55
almost separate now the university from
29:57
the neighborhood and the community. It’s
30:00
it’s become part of the story in a way
30:02
that um it’s attracting a lot of kids
30:05
here. I mean they they this generation
30:08
of young people want to be impactful
30:10
even before they leave college
30:13
and if they come here uh they have a
30:17
chance to be impactful in real real
30:20
ways. Um so it’s become it’s really
30:23
become a part of the story and very
30:26
honestly it goes back to I I absolutely
30:28
believe God wanted this to happen here.
30:31
I look out over our campus now and I
30:33
think what this used to look like 17
30:35
years ago and what it looks like now.
30:36
Classrooms, laboratories, residence
30:39
halls, 35 residence halls, 32
30:41
restaurants, six swimming pools, seven
30:43
fitness areas. Sometimes I are we
30:44
running a resort here? Are we running a
30:47
university? But who could have ever
30:51
imagined this uh happening in this short
30:53
of period of time? But it did.
30:53
Yeah. Yeah.
30:55
And we got to steward it now in a way
30:58
that the gospel becomes
30:59
winsome.
31:01
Yeah. Well, you talk about the impact
31:03
students can have. Schools are one of
31:05
the most unique organizations in the
31:08
world because people come to learn and
31:10
the plan is that you send them out
31:12
better than they came in, right? They’re
31:14
going to leave. And you know that that’s
31:18
part of the model. Uh how do you steward
31:19
that level of impact that a school like
31:21
GCU can have? There’s 100,000 students
31:24
or more here every year that you’re
31:26
sending out to go do something in the
31:28
world.
Education and Impact
31:30
Well, you know, we we’ve when I went to
31:32
Concordia College and I I had incredible
31:34
experience. It’s a great place.
31:35
Uh and they have a great teacher
31:37
education program. I a program I wanted
31:41
to be a a high school teacher. And um
31:42
but I told him the one thing that I I
31:45
think you should change is that uh when
31:47
we graduated, those of us that were
31:48
going into teaching or preaching
31:49
ministry got called into sacred
31:53
vocations. Everybody else got a job. And
31:56
we’ve told uh young people for decades,
31:57
uh it’s great that you have a passion of
32:00
biology or chemistry or or uh or
32:02
engineering, but if you really want to
32:04
serve Jesus, you have to give that up
32:07
and be a pastor. and and we need pastors
32:08
and we need teachers and we need
32:11
missionaries. But what we really need is
32:14
to send 31,000 graduates into the world
32:17
every single year into the workplace.
32:20
People that know how to take the gospel
32:22
into the workplace. We’re not going to
32:24
change the world by crowding into our
32:26
churches on Sunday morning. We need to
32:28
do that because we need to be inspired.
32:30
We need to be filled with spirit. But
32:32
then we need to take that into the
32:34
workplace where we spend the majority of
32:36
our time. We’re not going to change the
32:38
country or the world if we don’t change
32:40
the workplace. And so what we’ve wanted
32:43
our students to believe is that every
32:44
single one of them that’s going into
32:47
engineering or computer science or cyber
32:51
security has been called by God into a
32:53
sacred vocation and that their their
32:55
role is to be the best computer
32:58
scientist that they can be and reflect
33:01
who Jesus is through that and and in
33:04
that way spread the gospel. That is
33:07
That’s the most important thing I
33:09
believe that we need to do is to change
33:10
that whole thinking. Yes, we need
33:12
pastors, teachers, and missionaries, but
33:14
we’ve got to impact the workplace. And
33:17
so, students need to know how to leave
33:20
here and they need to know how to take
33:24
the gospel into whatever workplace God
33:25
has called them to. I come out of the
33:27
Luther tradition and it was Martin
33:29
Luther who said, “Every vocation is
33:31
equally honoring in God’s eyes.”
33:33
We talk, the Bible talks about how God
33:36
takes care of us. Well, 95% of how he
33:38
takes care of us is through other
33:40
people. It’s through the nurses that
33:41
help us be healthy. It’s through the
33:43
teachers who help us learn. It’s who the
33:45
it’s through the engineers who help us
33:46
make the world a better place in a in a
33:50
myriad of ways. God takes care of us
33:52
mainly through other people. I think he
33:54
directly intervenes frequently, but I
33:56
think most of what he how he takes care
33:58
of us is through other people. It’s the
33:59
farmer who grows the food. It’s the
34:01
trucker who puts it on the truck and
34:02
gets it to the grocery stores. That’s
34:05
how we eat. Um, and if everybody
34:07
approached it that way, we would we’d
34:09
live in a different world.
Vision and Growth
34:12
Well, the there’s a lot of people who
34:14
are listening to this, uh, myself
34:16
included, that often when we look at our
34:19
circumstances, we see the pie is this
34:21
big, however big it is. One of the
34:23
things that I love about GCU from the
34:25
outside is the pie might be that big,
34:27
but how do we make the pie bigger? A lot
34:28
of people are thinking about how do they
34:30
take a small sliver of the pie that they
34:32
can see. You’ve created a lot of these
34:34
things that are other revenue generating
34:36
opportunities. You’ve you’ve done a lot
34:40
to somehow make the pie bigger.
34:42
That’s a mentality, right? That’s not
34:44
that’s not just based on circumstances.
34:46
Everyone probably has opportunities that
34:48
they may or may not see to grow the pie
34:50
bigger rather than take small slices of
34:52
the pie they see. How do you encourage
34:54
people to see beyond what maybe they’re
34:57
seeing today and lean into maybe a a
34:58
higher calling? Yeah,
34:59
that’s that’s a great question and and
35:02
and I when people ask me about
35:05
leadership, I I uh I believe that the
35:07
number one characteristic
35:10
that needs to be developed in leaders is
35:11
vision.
35:13
It’s absolutely the number one thing.
35:17
Leaders have to see the future. They
35:19
have to see the future. They have to see
35:21
uh how we can make the future better
35:24
than what it is today. And then the
35:26
second way to answer that question is
35:29
when did Christians ever get scared of
35:32
growth? I I’m fascinated with the growth
35:34
of the early Christian church. I read
35:36
books on it constantly. Uh and it all
35:39
started in the book of Acts, right? Um
35:42
3,000 were added and 5,000 were added
35:44
and another thousand were added. You
35:46
know the growth of the early Christian
35:50
church I believe is because those those
35:54
12 those 11 and then Paul those those
35:56
people who had that direct
36:00
uh revelation who spent time with Jesus
36:05
were so connected to who he was and they
36:08
were able to reflect who he was in such
36:12
a powerful way that the the church grew
36:16
exponentially against all odds, right?
36:18
They had no political power. They had no
36:20
military power. They had no financial
36:23
resources. All they had was Pentecost
36:26
and the indwelling of the spirit. and
36:29
that direct contact they saw they saw
36:32
how big Jesus looked at this world
36:36
and um the fact that it grew like it did
36:40
and then it grew at a time when um there
36:43
was never a better way to justose who
36:47
Jesus was from who the Romans were.
36:50
The Romans were about power and control
36:55
and abuse and it’s everything uh for me
36:57
and Jesus saw everything from a
36:59
servants’s perspective and putting the
37:02
needs of others in front of your own and
37:05
that’s what attracted you know the in in
37:07
the early Christian uh in the first
37:10
century uh you know the Romans would put
37:13
deformed babies out on the outskirts of
37:15
town to be devoured or freezed to death
37:18
because it wasn’t worth taking care of
37:20
somebody that had those kinds of needs.
37:22
They asked the emperor in 250, I think
37:26
250 AD of Rome, “Why is this thing
37:27
growing so fast? And why can’t you stop
37:30
it?” He said, “These Christians, these
37:32
people don’t just care about their own
37:35
poor. They care about our poor. They
37:37
don’t care about their own handicapped
37:39
kids. They care about ours. They go out
37:40
there and take these kids and bring them
37:41
into their homes and raise them as their
37:45
own. It’s it’s it’s irresistible what
37:46
they’re doing and other it’s
37:48
irresistible.
God’s Vision and Growth
37:54
And so um we do uh see things uh in
37:58
terms of uh what God can do
38:01
because it far surpasses anything that
38:04
we could envision. Now we we had a good
38:06
idea when we got here. We had learned
38:08
some things that we thought could flip
38:09
this thing. You know, we hadn’t raised
38:12
tuition in 17 years. We put $2 billion
38:13
into the campus. We haven’t raised
38:16
tuition in 17 years. And uh our students
38:17
take out less debt than the average
38:21
state university student. Um and so we
38:22
learned some we had learned some things
38:24
we thought would work, we could have
38:26
never predicted this.
38:28
And and I think as long as we stay
38:33
rooted uh in the scripture and in the
38:36
gospel message and as long as that
38:39
becomes our primary
38:41
uh responsibility,
38:43
God’s going to continue to bless us. And
38:46
so it does become people around here
38:49
joke about it being Mueller math. Uh but
38:52
it it does become contagious. Yeah.
38:55
Not to you know most people sit around
38:57
at their jobs every day and point out
39:00
all the things that are not very good
39:01
and there are other people and it’s only
39:04
a few that are always thinking about not
39:07
how they are but how they could be
39:10
and and um those are the people you got
39:11
to get into your organization.
Vision and Energy
39:13
Yeah. How do you balance that like
39:15
vision? Because it’s so exciting and
39:17
inspiring and energizing and then
39:20
sometimes the vision comes true. Other
39:22
times it falls short of what the vision
39:24
is. How do you keep the energy alive?
39:25
And also when you cast really big
39:27
visions and maybe it falls short, how do
39:31
you keep everyone inspired even when you
39:34
don’t hit it? Some of our best ideas
39:38
were ideas we didn’t do. Uh you know and
39:41
and uh yes we made mistakes. Have we
39:42
have we done some things that haven’t
39:45
worked? Absolutely. Everybody does. Uh
39:47
we live in a fallen world. Things aren’t
39:52
perfect. Um, but you you you can’t uh
39:55
you you’ve got to embrace those failures
39:58
because every single failure gets you
40:00
closer to a success.
40:03
Um, and so yeah, there are things that
40:05
we’ve done that that haven’t worked. Uh,
40:07
but you rebound quickly and and and you
40:10
just keep going. Uh, I have a number of
40:12
major meetings that we use to run the
40:15
university. Um, we have what we call a
40:18
process meeting. Um once every couple
40:20
weeks there are 350 people in the room.
40:22
Every single area of the university is
40:24
represented. The academic area, the
40:26
marketing area, the technology area, the
40:28
the security area, everybody is
40:30
represented in that room. And we have a
40:33
very set agenda. And then we we we
40:35
always come out of that hour and a half
40:37
meeting with two new things we need to
40:38
work on, two new things that we need to
40:41
go out and research and and we need to
40:43
come back in two weeks with maybe we
40:45
could do this. Um, the world’s changing
40:48
so fast, the economy is changing so fast
40:51
that that we have to stay focused on
40:54
where the economy is going, where the
40:57
jobs are going to be, because we’ve got
40:59
to create people that can access those
41:00
employment opportunities that are
41:02
opportunities of the future, not 50
41:03
years ago.
University and Industry
41:05
Right?
41:08
One of the great things about the
41:09
university is that 70% of our 80% of our
41:11
programs now have been created in the
41:13
last 10 years. So, they’re new, they’re
41:15
modern. We have 22 advisory boards, 800
41:17
company companies on those advisory
41:20
boards because they want access to our
41:22
graduates. But what we need to use them
41:24
for is to make sure we understand I mean
41:26
the chip manufacturing industry is
41:31
blowing up in Arizona. We have a great
41:32
relationship with uh TSMC uh and we are
41:35
going to be a major player in developing
41:38
their talent moving forward. Um but it’s
41:42
that connectivity that allows us to
41:46
understand how to get really great
41:49
students really uh student our graduates
41:51
with great potential into the most
41:53
important industries in the state so
41:55
that we can have an impact. One of the
41:58
things that we haven’t done is get
42:00
enough of our people into uh into
42:02
Washington DC.
Political Influence
42:05
Uh and we need to do a much better job
42:07
of that. I I go there frequently. Um and
42:11
um we need those offices that that are
42:15
in on cap on the hill uh
42:18
representatives, senators, you walk into
42:19
those offices and that front person
42:23
needs to be a GCU grad. uh and we have
42:25
and and so we’re we’re really focused on
42:29
getting as many young people who are
42:31
interested in political science and
42:35
government and uh want to go to law
42:37
school uh getting them into positions of
42:39
influence in the government governmental
42:42
area too.
Education and Adaptation
42:43
You talk about education, nursing,
42:46
politics, things like that where you’re
42:48
seeing gaps and then you try to meet the
42:51
need. I would think that education is a
42:54
slowmoving ship because it seems like in
42:56
most education uh experiences I’ve had
42:59
it has been relatively the same for the
43:01
last 50 years. How do you make such
43:02
quick pivots as you see those needs
43:05
because the world is changing like
43:08
you’re saying it
43:11
it’s it’s um you know I meet with 27
43:12
public school superintendent three times
43:15
a year. I meet with uh um private school
43:17
superintendents. I meet with charter
43:20
school superintendent. Um, we have
43:22
26,000 students in our education
43:24
program. We’re the largest producer of
43:27
teachers in the world. We’re going to be
43:29
the largest producers of counselors and
43:32
social workers in the world. We need to
43:34
populate public schools and all schools
43:37
uh with with people who come from a
43:39
Christian worldview perspective uh so we
43:42
can get the gospel back into the public
43:44
school system. Um, you know, it it’s
43:46
really not hard as long as you’re
43:48
willing to do the hard work because
43:50
there’s an unbelievable need. You know,
43:52
I’ve got letters from the superintendent
43:54
of the New York public school district.
43:56
It thanks me profusely us at the
43:59
university for the work that we’re doing
44:01
to help them fulfill their teacher
44:02
shortage. How ironic is that? Uh that
44:05
would be some and you know we’re getting
44:08
those same kind of responses from the
44:11
major school districts throughout the
44:14
country. um as long as you’re willing to
44:16
to to sit with them and ask them uh what
44:18
it is they need, how they can move their
44:20
organization forward, uh that uncovering
44:23
the needs is not not there’s 27
44:27
superintendent, they’ve got school
44:30
teacher shortages, too. And I said, you
44:32
know, we got hundreds of kids that
44:34
graduate every year that want to work
44:37
here and um they had a great experience
44:39
here, but you guys have the same thing.
44:41
You got kids that loved their experience
44:44
at your high school. They love the
44:46
community that they work in. Uh they’d
44:48
love to teach for you. Let’s we created
44:51
what we call a 360 program where they
44:53
identify the kids that want to be
44:55
teachers. If they send them to us within
44:57
18 months, we’ll have them back to them
44:59
as pair of professionals. And with
45:01
another 18 months, we’ll have them back
45:02
to them as full-time teachers.
45:04
Uh and so we’ve got like six schools
45:06
now, six school districts that are doing
45:08
that with us. Eventually, we’ll have a
45:10
hundreds of school districts that will
45:12
do with do that with us. Um they were
45:14
sitting in a meeting one time and they
45:16
were complaining about the fact that uh
45:18
the morale is low because teachers can’t
45:20
use their planning periods to do
45:22
planning. They got to substitute teach
45:24
and I was listening to them talk. I
45:26
thought we got 25,000 really smart kids
45:28
on this campus. I I I guarantee you if
45:30
we give them a little bit of training
45:32
they can go into a third grade classroom
45:34
and substitute teach. What do you guys
45:36
pay? And they said 175 bucks a day. I
45:39
said you know what? You can’t make that
45:41
at Chick-fil-A. Uh and so we’ve got now
45:44
a process where they’re we’re taking
45:46
kids who want to work work for school
45:48
districts while they’re even if they’re
45:50
not going to be a teacher.
45:51
Um but we give them a little bit of
45:53
training and they substitute teach uh
45:54
and they’re making 175 bucks a day doing
45:57
that. It supplements their education
45:59
here. But a lot of schools they go into
46:01
these kids that have never even met a
46:03
college student.
46:05
Uh so think about the impact they’re
46:07
making in addition to the fact that
46:09
they’re making really good part-time
46:11
incoming income. and they’re having a
46:14
professional experience
Education and Workforce Connection
46:17
that connecting
46:19
uh education to the workplace is going
46:22
to be huge going forward. We’re trying
46:25
to get all of our kids in engineering
46:28
and business and finance and accounting
46:30
internships. Sometimes as early as our
46:32
sophomore year,
46:35
but but but for sure by the time they’re
46:37
a junior because so many times they’re
46:39
getting hired by those companies by
46:41
those companies that where they do their
46:44
internships. But connecting the world of
46:46
work and the world of school and making
46:49
it more integrated u is something that
46:51
is going to happen uh in the future.
46:54
Well, I love it. It goes back to that
46:56
untapped
Education’s Future Narrative
46:31
potential that you talked about
46:33
earlier and one of the narratives that I
46:35
think people are hearing which sounds
46:38
like a false narrative is that uh
46:40
education might not be important in the
46:43
future in things like uh if you go to
46:45
school there won’t be jobs for you. I
46:46
love how you’re approaching that and
46:48
actually hitting those issues head-on
46:49
because you might be seeing some of that
46:50
and you’re fixing it, coming up with
46:52
solutions. It’s just unbelievable.
Graduation in Three Years
46:55
Well, you know, we’ve said for years,
46:57
college college for most students
46:58
shouldn’t be four years.
46:58
Uh we’ve got over 50% of our students
47:00
now graduating in three years. And
47:02
that’s by design. We’ve got dual credit
47:04
things going on all over the country.
47:05
kids are coming here with 20, 30, 40
47:07
credits and they’re graduating in three
47:09
years, which is one of the reasons our
47:11
students are graduating with less debt
47:12
than the average state university
47:13
student. Um, and so that is um
Role of Professors
47:20
the the uh and I hear people talk the
47:23
way you phrase that question. Yeah.
47:25
You know, as human beings, we need other
47:29
human beings. Um, yes, students should
47:32
be able to learn content more
47:34
efficiently, but it’s going to take a
47:37
professor in a classroom that’s that’s
47:39
inspiring students, that’s giving them
47:41
confidence, that’s giving them
47:43
perspective, uh, that’s teaching them
47:45
how to think critically, that’s teaching
47:47
them how to solve problems.
AI and Higher Education
47:49
The content,
47:51
uh, the learning of the content because
47:54
of AI should be much more efficient. It
47:56
should happen much sooner. So the job of
47:59
the professor is going to be to motivate
48:02
and to inspire and to help them think
48:04
critically and to help them solve
48:06
problems. It’s that those higher order
48:09
thinking skills that are going to become
48:12
critical in higher education not just
48:15
standing in front of the professor or
48:17
standing in front of the classroom and
48:18
lecturing because the content can be
48:21
learned.
Accessible Content through AI
48:22
AI is going to make the content so
48:24
accessible. It can be delivered in the
48:26
written form. format can be delivered
48:28
through audio or through video or but
48:31
it’s that next step in those higher
48:33
order thinking skills that is going to
48:36
make college what college should be.
48:38
Yeah, I love it. This is so inspiring.
Rapidfire Questions
48:41
Uh I want to finish with 10 rapidfire
48:43
questions that I’ll ask you and you just
48:45
say the first thing that comes to mind.
48:47
Who’s the first person you think of when
48:49
I say servant leadership?
48:51
Well, Jesus. Uh
48:52
all right. Yeah.
Describing Brian Mueller
48:53
Five words that most describe you. not
48:56
very smart,
48:57
uh, but ambitious, willing to think big,
49:03
um, want to be part of a great team,
49:06
had the good fortune of coming from a
49:07
great family.
Favorite Author
49:08
Yeah, I I know you like to read.
49:10
Favorite author or book?
49:12
Uh, probably Tim Keller. I mean, you
49:14
know, I probably read everything that
49:16
he’s ever written and and connecting uh,
49:18
church to the workplace and helping
49:20
people understand how to bring the
49:22
gospel into the workplace. He was the
49:24
foremost thinker on that.
Impactful School Subject
49:25
What was the most impactful school
49:27
subject subject on you?
49:30
Uh it was theology.
49:31
It was theology.
Excitement at GC
49:32
Is that your favorite subject if you
49:34
could choose any? Okay.
49:35
Yeah.
49:35
Uh when you look around GC, what are you
49:37
most excited about today?
49:39
The students. The students. People come
49:41
on this campus and they say it’s
49:42
different. Student your kids are happy.
49:44
They’re they’re polite. They uh they
49:47
hold the door open. Uh they’re obviously
49:50
uh excited to be here. they’re excited
49:52
what’s going on. It it it’s that it’s
49:55
fact that, you know, colleges have
49:56
become very dark places. They be they’ve
49:59
become places that are are uh they’re
50:02
kind of ugly in a way. You know, people
50:03
are protesting. They’re throwing rocks
50:05
and they’re breaking windows and they’re
50:07
and they’re talking about how bad a
50:09
place America is. Um is it a perfect
50:12
place? No. It’s a flawed place, but the
50:14
potential of it is unbelievable. And um
50:17
people experience that when they come
50:19
here. That’s the most exciting thing by
50:21
far.
Free Time Activities
50:21
Wow. Favorite thing to do in your free
50:23
time?
50:24
Uh family. Family. Got four boys. They
50:26
all live within three miles of us. And
50:28
they got four grandkids now. And uh uh
50:31
all four of my kids played golf. And my
50:33
oldest son’s playing golf at a
50:35
professional level still. Played two US
50:37
Opens, two PGA Championships, and now my
50:39
I got two grandsons that are 11 years
50:41
old. And and they are they are getting
50:43
into it. And every chance I get to play
50:45
golf with them that nothing makes me
50:46
happier than that.
Surprising Fact
50:47
Wow. That’s awesome. Uh, what’s a
50:49
surprising fact about you?
50:52
I’m sitting here being the president of
50:53
Grand Canyon University. I don’t think
50:55
there were a lot of people predicting
50:57
that when I left high school.
Favorite Place
50:58
Oh, I love that. Where’s your favorite
51:00
place you’ve ever been?
51:02
Arizona. Arizona. I, you know, I I loved
51:06
Arizona the first time I came here. Uh,
51:09
you know, wide open spaces, blue skies,
51:11
the mountains are an hour away, hot, dry
51:14
weather. I just I love Arizona.
Best Advice Received
51:16
Wow. uh best advice you’ve ever
51:18
received.
51:19
My dad told me so many things. I mean,
51:21
he was a World War II veteran. He was
51:23
involved in the uh in World War II and
51:27
um had a had a successful career. Um and
51:32
u
51:33
uh one of the things that you know
51:37
I think it when people ask me, you know,
51:39
you seem like you have confidence. Where
51:41
did you get that confidence? You know,
51:43
it it comes from the family. It comes
51:45
from your parents who are accepting of
51:48
of uh you even in spite of your
51:50
failures. And it’s that constant
51:52
reinforcement you get in your early
51:54
years that gives you the confidence that
51:56
you could do something.
Building a Team
51:58
And and um uh when it when it comes to
52:01
break building a team, I my dad used to
52:03
say, forget the interview. People are
52:06
going to do what they have done in the
52:07
past. They will continue to do what they
52:09
have done in the past. So look at their
52:11
track record because you’re going to get
52:12
more of that. And if it’s good, hire up.
Importance of Servant Leadership
52:14
Wow, that’s really good. Uh, and
52:17
finally, this is a podcast on servant
52:18
leadership. Why is it important for
52:20
people to care about servant leadership
52:22
and become better servant leaders?
52:24
Uh, it because because it’s it ever
52:26
since the fall of Adam and Eve, it’s our
52:28
desire to be God and not have a
52:30
relationship with God that’s caused all
52:31
the problems.
Human Nature and Leadership
52:33
You know, it’s it’s uh when people ask
52:35
me about original sin, I said, “Have you
52:37
raised kids?
52:39
What what does your 2-year-old say more
52:42
often than not? Mine. Uh you have to
52:46
teach them to, you know, care about
52:48
their brothers and sisters, to be nice
52:50
to their, you know, it’s it’s u it’s
52:53
that that’s that’s the basic flaw in
52:55
human beings that will never go away.
52:57
And we need to be reborn so that we have
52:59
the ability to think about putting the
53:01
needs of others in front of our own. It
53:03
causes the world to be a better place.
Focus on Others
53:05
Um, some of the most miserable people in
53:07
the world are Hollywood people who
53:10
become so
53:12
in spite of all their success and all
53:13
the agilation and all the money and all
53:15
that, they they seem to be the most
53:16
miserable people in the world because
53:18
they’re so focused on themselves. And we
53:20
have a society today in a culture today
53:23
that is telling uh people to do what’s
53:27
best for you.
53:28
And that’s the surefire way to become
53:32
very depressed. Uh it’s when we are
53:35
focused on helping other people that we
53:37
become most
53:39
like Jesus and who we were born to be.
Podcast Closing
53:42
Wow. That’s so good. Well, Brian, I love
53:45
what you’re doing here. Thank you for
53:46
being on the podcast. I really
53:48
appreciate you and your wisdom and
53:49
sharing with our audience.
53:50
Well, congratulations on everything that
53:52
you’ve done because it’s a you’ve had a
53:54
remarkable career and thank you for
53:55
doing this.
53:56
Thank you for listening to this episode
53:58
of the Servant Leadership Podcast. If
54:01
you enjoyed what you heard, please give
54:02
it a thumbs up and leave a comment
54:04
below. Don’t forget to subscribe and hit
54:08
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54:10
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54:12
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54:13
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54:15
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